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Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

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Hatchtopia

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Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostMon Jul 23, 2012 9:09 am

So I recently discovered that the camber is not adjustable from the factory on the '07 Kia Rondo. I don't know if this is a common thing, but common enough that someone invented a set of adjustable control arms that can be retrofitted to make it so that your Kia Rondo *does* have adjustable rear camber. I know this because I paid $300 along with two new tires and a full rotation after discovering significant flat spots on my rear tires.

I had assumed that this new adjustable bits would cure the problem along with the alignment, etc...

But no, I can see that there are flat spots appearing again on the inside edge of my tires. Serious cupping to form soon, I'm sure.

So what the hell is wrong with this car? Worn suspension parts? It only has 49k on it... Improper camber adjustment? Arg. I really don't feel like spending a grundle on this thing to have to replace tires every year or so. This car has positively EATEN tires. The first set lasted about 24k, the replacements (with a 60k warranty) lasted another 24 or so.

I'm thisclose to start shopping for a new car. I take that back. I'm already looking. Dammit.
My garage: 2005 Ford Escape, 1972 BMW R75/5, 2003 Vespa ET4, 1975 Apache Royal
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Xedicon

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostMon Jul 23, 2012 1:07 pm

I do know that camber bolts can be used to help gain adjustment on vehicles that get lowered, maybe that would help? I do not know for sure if they would fix your specific problem, but maybe something worth looking into.
94 XJ Country, 09 Cobalt SS/TC 4 door, 02 Yamaha Road Warrior
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skitter

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostMon Jul 23, 2012 5:45 pm

Was it adjusted outside of the factory camber spec, if there even is one?
What pressures are you running?
Where is there more camber gain: bump or droop?
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Stu_Rock

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostTue Jul 24, 2012 11:20 pm

Just to make sure, you're seeing something like the right tire below, right?
Image
If so, that's usually camber wear.

Do you frequently operate this vehicle with a larger load than it had during its alignment? I've noticed many import utility vehicles with independent rear suspensions can develop extreme negative camber when the vehicle is heavily loaded.

What is the current camber setting? Maybe if it's much more negative than -0.5°, try to get it there. If it's already there, you could go for 0° or even +0.5°.
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Hatchtopia

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostWed Jul 25, 2012 5:26 am

Here's the type of wear I'm seeing:

Image

The camber was waaaay out of spec according to the tire shop a while back. So I got new rear tires and a product similar to this: http://www.iapdirect.com/spc-hyundai-elantra-kia-optima-rear-camber-arm-kit.html because the camber on the rear is not adjustable on the Rondo (again, according to the tire guy). So supposedly, they fixed the camber, alligned all four tires and I'm developing the same wear pattern with the rear tires again.

As far as load, the alignment adjustment was done with no load - I took a long family roadtrip with a moderate load (just myself and my wife, baby and accoutrements) and recently hauled a <700 pound trailer about 15 miles. So no extreme loads. The alignment and camber adjustment was about 3000 miles ago.

I'm going to take it in to the tire place that fixed it and see what they tell me, but I'm still soliciting suggestions as I don't want them to just tell me that they will install some other gadget to fix it and send me off with no real fix...
My garage: 2005 Ford Escape, 1972 BMW R75/5, 2003 Vespa ET4, 1975 Apache Royal
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skitter

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostWed Jul 25, 2012 6:08 am

The reason I asked about camber gain was the possibility that this is the result of enthusiastic cornering. Relative to the ground plane, if you're getting a lot of camber when the Rondo is loaded up, it's going to eat the outside tire on the inside. Relative to the Rondo, if you get very little camber in droop, it's going to eat the inside tire on the inside. I should make a paint illustration.

Edit:
Image
It should not do both, unless they really screwed up the geometry, but it's reasonable that it might do one or the other under roll.
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Hatchtopia

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostWed Jul 25, 2012 7:34 am

I can assure you, it's not enthusiastic cornering. My typical drive is 15 miles of straight interstate to work. There's one off ramp that I take a 90-degree turn at a pretty good clip, but that's 4 times a week. So I can't picture that doing it. I'm leaning toward some sort of worn suspension part causing excessive jacking up and down, but that wouldn't explain the wear on the inside edge only.
My garage: 2005 Ford Escape, 1972 BMW R75/5, 2003 Vespa ET4, 1975 Apache Royal
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Stu_Rock

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostWed Jul 25, 2012 2:28 pm

I would call that cupping and not camber wear. Check bushings, bearings, ball joints, and tie rods (if applicable) for excessive movement. I don't think alignment is going to fix that problem. Sometimes a bushing will seem OK under arm-strength loading but will move a lot under vehicle loading, so use some sort of tool for leverage while checking.
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Alcology

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostSat Jul 28, 2012 5:47 pm

Just some slight research uncovered this is a common, but random, problem. Build quality is probably the issue. I don't what this means, but it was on www.mycarstats.com and has tons of comments about the Rondo:

"I also had a problem with the rear wheels going badly out of alignment. The alignment shop told me there was means by which they could be aligned. I took it to a KIA dealer. KIA refused to cover the problem under the current warrantee. The dealer fixed the problem at my expense by driiling an extra hole for each rear wheel. I returned to the independent alignment shop for an opinion on the repair and was assured that this was an appropriate repair that should cause no further trouble. "

http://www.mycarstats.com/reports/kia/r ... ments.aspx

Just found this with more research on the kia-forums:

"Originally Posted by cvbeek
strange tire wear latest update! . Kia has realesed special bolts to allow the frt camber to be adjusted properly and have also relesed special adjustable rear tie bar assemblies to allow the the rear camber to be adjusted properly. Once these updated components are installed the alignment can be corrected . This should dramatically improve the the wear and life of the tires on the vehicle. I am booking my Rondo into the dealer this week to get these updated parts installed and alignment corrected."

Part #'s were listed below as :

"I have finally had the updated parts installed and the alignment adjusted. I also had to get new tires but won't run them till spring comes , will just have to keep an eye on the snow tire wear for now.Here are the part numbers as they apear on the shop work order. K90474 CAMBER ADJ BOLT KIT- QTY 2 . SPC67410 EZ-ARM ADJ RONDO-QTY 2 . 545592E000 FLANGE NUT-SELF LOC-QTY 2 . Hope everone gets thier tire wear issue resolved ."

More info in the thread here:

http://www.kia-forums.com/kia-carens-ro ... ear-4.html
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Alcology

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostMon Aug 06, 2012 6:04 am

So did you fix it? Did you fix it and sell it and get a new car? Did you just say screw it and get a new car?
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Hatchtopia

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostWed Aug 15, 2012 11:51 am

SORRY! It's been really busy here in Hatchtopia.

I need to take a close look at the links provided above (thanks for that!) and get an appointment at the tire place to discuss.

HOWEVER, since then, the ESC OFF light has come on intermittently (again) and I'm really reaching the end of my rope with this car. The fact is, I've had issues with the ESC light, a fuel pump that was pushing about half of its required pressure, causing constant CEL warnings, alignment issues mentioned above, normal wear on tires of about 25k miles, someone keyed it, door dings everywhere, bad curb rash on one wheel...

Uggh. It was my plan to baby this car and drive it for a decade. I don't think that's going to happen. Honestly, with the above issues I've had, I just don't trust it anymore. The dealership has been decent enough to work with on warrantee issues (though it took 4 visits to resolve the CEL issue and only after I begged them to look at the fuel pump because of similar problems on the 4-cyl version), but that warrantee is almost gone (I'm the second owner, so I only get 5y/60k instead of the 10y/100k of a new Kia buyer).

I will update the thread when I get to the tire store. Until then, I'm thinking about a RWD Volvo wagon in decent shape that I can drive for a while until I get the gumption to do a V8 conversion...
My garage: 2005 Ford Escape, 1972 BMW R75/5, 2003 Vespa ET4, 1975 Apache Royal
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Alcology

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Re: Nevermind the woodgrain, I need this fixed...

PostWed Aug 15, 2012 2:32 pm

Dang man, that's a bummer. Live and learn and ditch the car! haha
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